Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder [#16053]

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paulonl
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Joined: Mon May 13, 2019 9:24 am

Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder [#16053]

Post by paulonl » Tue Oct 22, 2019 10:41 am

I select a subfolder with some tracks in a Location directory and want to move the subfolder + tracks to another folder.

So right click -> send to -> folder (move) -> select 'new folder' and this should create .\new folder\subfolder\track1, ...2, ...3, etc.

What happens now is that all tracks are moved to .\new folder\track1, ...2, ...3, etc., so the subfolder is not created in the target. What does happen is that the Subfolder is removed in the original location which is ok.

It appears to me that the subfolder should have been created in the destination, since that was the object that was moved...

Barry4679
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Re: 2201 - Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder

Post by Barry4679 » Tue Oct 22, 2019 8:57 pm

paulonl wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2019 10:41 am
I select a subfolder with some tracks in a Location directory and want to move the subfolder + tracks to another folder.
The problem is that from a MM perspective, you are just selecting a group of files, not a sub folder, nor a hierarchy of subfolders ... ie. maybe you were in a specific folder, and did a Select All ... or maybe you just did a did a search on "The Beatles", got files from multiple locations, and then did a Select All.

And people upgrading from MM4 will expect this behaviour.

paulonl wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2019 10:41 am
It appears to me that the subfolder should have been created in the destination, since that was the object that was moved...
I have also often wished this. ... I have never liked this omission in MM4 .. my work flow is to:
  • rip to my PC disk
  • open MM, and add tracks ... tidy tags and art
  • then move to my NAS using MM
    • but I first have to create artist and album folders on my NAS ... which is a pain, and I would like MM to help me by creating the new folders
I can see that the existing behaviour is the desired behaviour in some Use Cases.
Maybe a good compromise would be to have either:
  • a 2nd set of Send Move and Copy menu options which create the containing folders, where they don't exist in the target location
  • or create the folders, if the existing menu options are used with the shift key held down
A problem is that MM doesn't seem to have a Tools|Options setting for rip location (surprise (to me), because I use another tool to rip CDs)
This means that there is no setting that could tell them how deep down the source folder hierarchy to reach, when creating missing folders at the target location.

Your observation that MM5 deletes the source folder in a SendTo|FolderMove operation is interesting ... MM4 did not do this.

Maybe it is an enhancement ... but maybe it is a bug ... ?

Ludek
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Re: 2201 - Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder

Post by Ludek » Wed Oct 23, 2019 2:09 am

  • rip to my PC disk
  • open MM, and add tracks ... tidy tags and art
Why don't you simply use MM to rip the CD directly to your NAS and thus creating the folder structure for you using the target mask?

  • then move to my NAS using MM
    • but I first have to create artist and album folders on my NAS ... which is a pain, and I would like MM to help me by creating the new folders
Why don't you use auto-organize feature that automatically creates the folders based on the mask?

Maybe a good compromise would be to have either:
  • a 2nd set of Send Move and Copy menu options which create the containing folders, where they don't exist in the target location
  • or create the folders, if the existing menu options are used with the shift key held down
With respect to you, in the other thread you wrote "MM5 UI is already complex enough", so are these your suggestions going to make MM5 UI even more complex??

A problem is that MM doesn't seem to have a Tools|Options setting for rip location (surprise (to me), because I use another tool to rip CDs)
This means that there is no setting that could tell them how deep down the source folder hierarchy to reach, when creating missing folders at the target location.
Why the rip location should be in options? The last rip location is restored whenever the Rip CD dialog is opened again -- so simply the lastly configured rip location is preserved (just like it would be configured in options)

Barry4679
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Re: 2201 - Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder

Post by Barry4679 » Wed Oct 23, 2019 3:25 am

I am not the OP ... just saying that the OP's request is something that I have often wished for also... ie. the option to shift folder containers using MM, as well as facility to shift just files that were in containers

Ludek wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 2:09 am
Why don't you simply use MM to rip the CD directly to your NAS and thus creating the folder structure for you using the target mask?
I have been using dBpoweramp long before MM. It is a excellent tool that specialises on just that function. I would shift if it wasn't meeting my needs. I have had no reason, so far, to trial MM for that purpose. ... I suspect dBpoweramp has superior functionality, but to be fair I don't know. Maybe I will look at it.

Ludek wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 2:09 am
Why don't you use auto-organize feature that automatically creates the folders based on the mask?
That's for en-masse reconstructions isn't it? I have never used it. ... it is useful for drag and drop a couple of albums?

Ludek wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 2:09 am
With respect to you, in the other thread you wrote "MM5 UI is already complex enough", so are these your suggestions going to make MM5 UI even more complex??
Have you had your morning coffee yet? ... Chill

I am just agreeing that a facility to move folders, additional to the facility to move files, would be useful to me also.

You are quoting out of context ... I didn't suggest that MM has too much functionality ... just that where the UI refers to a single thing, by multiple different names, this needlessly makes MM more complex. ... ie what i said was "MM5 UI is already complex enough ... don't make it more complex by referring to the same thing, using different names"


Why the rip location should be in options? The last rip location is restored whenever the Rip CD dialog is opened again -- so simply the lastly configured rip location is preserved (just like it would be configured in options)
Well, most everything else is in there.

It doesn't need to be there ... I have no opinion on that. I was just trying to explain to the OP that there is a difficulty delivering what is being asked for.
ie. one user may store music in /AlbumArtist/Album ... and another may just have /Genre/Album folders ... etc

So since you didn't have a central specification for the user's folder scheme, you won't know which folder(s) needed to moved|created.
I wasn't intending to imply criticism. ... Sorry if was unclear.

[UPDATE] Further apologies to Ludek and the OP for creating confusion in this thread. I was over-thinking the OP's request. ... There is no need to have access to the User's folder scheme, to achieve what the OP was asking for. ... I still think that the OP's suggestion would be useful addition to MM at some stage.

paulonl
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Re: 2201 - Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder

Post by paulonl » Wed Oct 23, 2019 1:46 pm

So the question was, why is the subfolder not copied? Is this a bug?

Barry4679
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Re: 2201 - Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder

Post by Barry4679 » Wed Oct 23, 2019 8:08 pm

paulonl wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 1:46 pm
So the question was, why is the subfolder not copied? Is this a bug?
Not a bug. Is As Designed. ... You are making a feature request.

From their MM4 manual:
Moving Tracks Manually
Tracks can easily moved from one folder to another:

First select any group of Tracks in the Track list.
Drag and Drop the selected Tracks into another folder contained within the Locations or My Computer node. Alternatively, right-click and use the Send-to Folder command.
All of the songs will be moved from their original location to the new location and the Library will be updated. If the all Tracks in the folder are moved, then you'll also be given the option to move any accompanying files such as Album Art or Lyrics.
The deleting of the source folder (if becomes empty during track moves) behaviour that you noticed may be a bug ... or an enhancement .. ?

paulonl
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Re: 2201 - Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder

Post by paulonl » Thu Oct 24, 2019 3:42 am

Sorry Barry, but I've heard enough of your opinion and suggestions. In several areas MM5 has deliberately different functionality from MM4. Could you please allow somebody from MediaMonkey to reply??
Last edited by paulonl on Thu Oct 24, 2019 4:16 am, edited 1 time in total.

Barry4679
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Re: 2201 - Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder

Post by Barry4679 » Thu Oct 24, 2019 4:06 am

paulonl wrote:
Thu Oct 24, 2019 3:42 am
Sorry Barry, but I've heard enough of your opinion and suggestions. Could you please allow somebody from MediaMonkey to reply??
Sure, why don't you open a ticket?

This is a Community Forum. I'm not stopping anyone else replying.

paulonl
Posts: 24
Joined: Mon May 13, 2019 9:24 am

Re: 2201 - Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder

Post by paulonl » Thu Oct 24, 2019 5:00 am

You know, I have 20 years of IT under my belt, from assembler programming to systems architect to running development projects for large government agencies and multinationals. So I am very aware of the difference between bugs and features. I have described a very clear scenario and asked what the behavior should be.

Have I asked for suggestions about anyone's workflow? Still, you hijack this topic with your view thereby blurring the essence of this topic with the result that my question is not answered.

Software is developed based on functional specs. MM5 as far as I know is a complete redesign of MM4 thus the specs differ in multiple areas from MM4. Ie., the only way to determine whether something is a bug or a feature is to look at the specs.

Did you do that? I guess not since you're a user, not a developer. Hence it would be wise if you could stop polluting this topic any further with your unsolicited opinions.

Ludek
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Re: 2201 - Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder

Post by Ludek » Thu Oct 24, 2019 5:09 am


paulonl
Posts: 24
Joined: Mon May 13, 2019 9:24 am

Re: 2201 - Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder

Post by paulonl » Thu Oct 24, 2019 6:32 am

Thanks Ludek!

Barry4679
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Re: 2201 - Location subfolder send to/move only copies tracks, not subfolder

Post by Barry4679 » Thu Oct 24, 2019 6:59 am

paulonl wrote:
Mon Sep 02, 2019 8:45 am
Thanks Barry for sharing your workflow. It has given me some ideas...
paulonl wrote:
Thu Oct 24, 2019 5:00 am
Have I asked for suggestions about anyone's workflow? Still, you hijack this topic ...

paulonl, I'm not here for a pissing contest ... just here to help MM5 get over the finish line, and to help make it be as good as it can be.

If you don't like my posts, there is a "Foe" button on at User Profile. Maybe it will silence them for you.

Barry

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